that is the best advice and the best use of a rainbow in a graphic ever.
all I have to add is that ear protection is also a good idea.
Templar Connect » Inconsequential Prattle
Project: Poorcraft
(267 posts)-
pencilears
MemberPosted 11 months ago # -
that is the best advice and the best use of a rainbow in a graphic ever.
all I have to add is that ear protection is also a good idea.Oh totally. Double earpro (plugs and muffs) even better. I'm a little deaf in one ear and had to work through a monster flinch because when I first started out shooting I did it at an indoor range and just wore the crappy earmuffs from my workshop - and the guy in the stall next to me was inevitably some jackass shooting an M4gery with a huge fucking muzzle brake.
Eyes, too. Glasses do fine mostly, if you've got 'em, but guns based off of combat arms tend to spray hot brass and burning powder goddamn everywhere. Most staffed ranges require and sell both, so that's an easy one to remember.
Glad you liked it, got worried I was getting a little wordy there. I guess I could do something about buying a gun, too, seeing as I've dealt with the good and bad there, but my priorities were generally pretty different than someone who's looking for a utilitarian firearm. I guess I can leave it at internet good, pawnshops bad, research specific models and years and don't just go by whatever brand name you recognize?
Posted 11 months ago # -
pencilears
Memberwell if I personally was going to have guns, I'd just talk to my uncle he's one of the gun guys you mentioned, and call it a day.
all of my knowledge of weapons (and most of what I know about WWII) comes from lectures he'd give me and my sister when we were kids. He taught us to shoot guns and bows too. (me and kenz shot our barbies firing squad style, complete with last cigarette, in his side yard firing range when we were little, good times)anyway, I was going to apologize for getting us onto more rural survival and away from urban and suburban stuff and then I remembered perch.
perch are a fish that likes shallow bodies of water and are ideally suited to living in stormwater retention ponds. which obviously could use some fish in them not just for feeding the other wildlife that inevitably flocks to these ponds, but for feeding the urban fisher.
catch a bunch at a lake, keep them live and in a bucket then move them to a reliable stormwater pond, et voilah!stocking fish is however, one of those things that is killing mother earth. perch are native species but not all fish species that you could do this with are.
Posted 10 months ago # -
Weirdling
MemberYou may want to seriously think about the stormwater retention fishing option. Just like its a holding area for stormwaters, it also collects all the wonderful road crud (oil, antifreeze, fecal matter, decaying roadkill) that's deposited on the asphalt. Some areas may have restrictions based on the amounts of heavy metals that can be accumulated in fish flesh. In this case, keeping them in a bucket or in some cases, bathtub, with fresh water for a few days will help clean out some of the gunk and make the meat a bit more palatable.
However, if you're hungry and that's an option....well, I've heard it said that hunger is the best seasoning.
Posted 10 months ago # -
maecrab
MemberI thought I'd mention a few things about dogs, since we haven't mentioned a whole lot about minimizing pet expenses, which can be huge. I come from a long line of people who buy dog food before people food (and if asked, will admit Alpo isn't so bad, once you get used to it) but dogs get bored, and I know mine "kill" their stuffed toys pretty quick, too. Since it makes no difference whatsoever regarding the toy's life span, dollar stores have cheap little plushes that do just as well as Petco's, sometimes (baby toys, mostly) even with squeakies. Just don't buy any with buttons or dangly bells or anything, for obvious reasons. Another tip that I actually got by asking on the Craigslist pet forums was on making dog beds; I had an incontinent Rottweiller for two years (I had to put her down yesterday
) and it was hard to find cheap, washable beds big enough for her. One women suggested dollar store bathmats, which would also make good beds for small dogs, I think, and they have the benefit of being washable (and are water-proof on the bottom; also good for lining puppy crates). And if you're crafty, another tip I got was to go to thrift stores and buy one or two of those god-awful children's comforters—you know, the kind they sell at WalMart with kittens and cartoon characters and shit printed on them, that the stitching comes out of and becomes nappy as hell within months. Cut or fold it down to the size you want, sew the edges (and any holes) shut, and then sew the layers together in a few places by looping yarn through them and tying the ends in a knot on the underside. If the pattern on it is too hideous to bear, you can always make a case for it by sewing a thrift-store bedsheet in half. This bed also has the benefit of being very washable, and is pretty sturdy, VERY cheap, and you can stack several of them up (especially for an older dog with bad hips on hard floors, like mine).
Unfortunately, I don't have any tips on low-cost treats, but would LOVE to hear some.Posted 10 months ago # -
Maecrab, I'm planning on doing exactly that comforter thing to make a travel bed for my son. *cough*
There are recipes online for dog and cat cookies. I've never tried making them, but they look inexpensive and nutritious. If people have the resources, from what I've heard, raw meat diets for dogs and cats are less expensive and healthier for the animals. They eat less because the nutrients are more concentrated (waaaay less filler), have healthier coats and immune systems, don't excrete as much (again, less filler). Some larger cities have pet shops that sell packages of ready made raw food meals, however if you have the right equipment you can make your own.
Posted 10 months ago # -
maecrab
Memberfrom what I've heard, raw meat diets for dogs and cats are less expensive and healthier for the animals. They eat less because the nutrients are more concentrated (waaaay less filler), have healthier coats and immune systems, don't excrete as much (again, less filler). Some larger cities have pet shops that sell packages of ready made raw food meals, however if you have the right equipment you can make your own.
This is totally true. There are also some people I've found on the net while researching this that suggest feeding a dog (above a certain size) a raw meat meal only once or twice a week instead of daily, because the "gorge once and digest" pattern is how wolves originally ate, and dogs still have wolves' digestive systems. If you do this, they suggest feeding at random intervals and times of day, to keep the dogs from getting food anxiety.
You can also buy kibble that has 0 grain content, which is the definition of filler for dogs; in the wild there was no way for them to get grains, and their body simply doesn't use carbohydrates. The kibble I'm feeding my dogs right now is 32% protein, 18% fat, and 50% veggies. This shit is expensive, I'm not gonna lie, but my dogs do eat less of it than regular kibble, and just switching their food made a big difference in their weight immediately. Someone told me recently, too, that the corn used for filler in many kibbles has been linked to causing tumors (lipomas, especially) in dogs as they get older. I don't necessarily believe this, but I can't be the only one noticing how dogs ALL seem to get fucking tumors past a certain age lately (last 6-10 years or so). And ALL THEY EAT is kibble, so it's gotta be something, right? And we all know kibble-makers are Satan's own beloved spawn, anyway.
In fact, the reason I switched to this kibble in the first place was that my Rott was 1.incontinent, which has been shown to go away almost entirely when switching to a low-grain diet (which it did)
2.had had several tumors removed already. It may be a case of too little too late for her, but it was eventually a tumor that appeared last week that made me put her down, so I can't say.
I would rather do raw food for them ultimately, but both of my dogs weigh 60-75 pounds.Posted 10 months ago # -
birdtongue
Memberi'm glad the pet food topic came up, as it's something i've struggled with for a long while. my cats, like all cats, are freaks. their particular shared quirk is that they very rarely will eat meat -- i've offered them soaked jerky (cleaned of salt and softened), cooked and raw chicken and beef, smoked salmon, canned cat food of various kinds.... nothin consistent or frequent. so i have to stick with kibble, and while i now have a slightly larger budget for it, i'm confused by the options. they occasionally have problems, respectively, with vomiting and keeping their weight -- this has largely seemed to clear up since i started giving them both Purin@ 1 Sensitive Systems. but with so many damn ingredients, i'm nearly sure that there's something better out there, though it is probably more than i can afford. as i said, i'm just a bit overwhelmed, but they seem pretty happy at the moment.
Posted 10 months ago # -
maecrab, I've heard that about food scheduling as well. It sounds pretty sensible to me.
I'm not sure about the "no grains in nature" thing, though. Dogs do eat grass, and when they take down a small animal like a rabbit, they eat the grass/grain-filled stomachs as well as everything else. That being said, there is a HELL of a lot of grain filler in most (all?) mass produced dog (and cat) food.
Posted 10 months ago # -
fishcake
MemberDogs are by nature carnivores - the cellulosic material that they eat incidentally in the wild is more than enough for their diets. I'm not even sure if they need any fibre. Either way, anything this isn't meat would just pass through their short, smooth intestinal tract, which isn't built for anything really other than raw flesh.
Posted 10 months ago # -
Yeah that isn't really true though, any more than saying that because we're "omnivores" we can and have to eat literally everything with no discernment. Dogs need meat, but they can eat pretty much anything people do, and you can look at any rescue greyhound and see how badly a raw-meat-only diet fucks them up, everything from their guts twisting themselves in knots to their teeth rotting out of their heads at age three.
"In the wild" is a totally fake idea for dogs as much as for any domesticated animal - their natural environment for tens of thousands of years has been coexisting with humans, eating human food or garbage, "in the wild" dogs will fucking die. Never mind that wolves don't really work that way either, canids in general are much more opportunistic omnivores than, say, cats. Give 'em raw meat, give 'em kibble, give 'em selected table scraps if you can keep them from learning to beg, you will never have a problem if you don't just pick one and decide that's all they get forever. Even the corn-based stuff is okay in a pinch, it's basically nutritionally empty for them but it cleans their teeth and GI tract real well, and it's laced with nutritional supplements meant to complement meats. Read what the vets and nutritionists say with a critical eye towards stuff that's obvious advertising fakery, Google it if you have to, don't raise your poodle based on some vague assumption about how wolves act.
Maybe I should do a m-m-m-megapost about nutrition and food safety because damn between this and the 'go ahead and eat game out of tainted sources, it's cool and natural!' thing I get the impression some people have entirely the wrong ideas about what to put in their mouths. This is why I really didn't want to get into the hunting thing, next thing I know some wannabe nature-boy is gonna gutshot a tularemia rabbit and eat it extra rare, and the emergency room bill'll come out of my tax money.
Posted 10 months ago # -
birdtongue
Memberi've known dogs and cats that, to all appearances, eat grass for pleasure, and other times, to induce vomiting after a bad food choice. all things in moderation in action, but Google results suggest the above reasons, as well as theorizing that the grass fibers might attach to internal parasites or furballs, and are then purged.
anyway, going back to the large amounts of grain filler (specifically corn) which shows up in American food, human and otherwise -- i read "The Omnivore's Dilemma" a couple months ago. i've never been one for high fructose corn syrup, but while it wasn't the main thrust of the book, it was still eye-opening in revealing just how bafflingly widely corn is used in products, and why. i particularly like the "most helpful" critical review of it on Amazon, as the guy points out where the author glosses over or neglects to follow a line of thinking to its logical conclusion; a bit of a counterpoint in theme to Poorcraft, i think. still, an entertaining and informative read.
Posted 10 months ago # -
Actually, some dogs do very well when they go feral. They form packs, they hunt smaller animals (domestic and wild), and they eat garbage. They also attack humans some time, but I'm assuming that most feral dogs (at least in the area I grew up) escaped from abusive/neglectful situations.
I've read that the grass==puke thing is a result, now, of the chemicals that people spray on lawns.
The corn-as-common-food-additive thing is a big problem because, like peanuts, a lot of people are allergic to corn and the allergies are rearing their ugly heads now because corn is in EVERYTHING-- but corn allergy hasn't really been recognized as a common thing yet so people keep eating it and wondering why they feel like crap. I have a friend of a friend who has to scrutinize labels because everything has corn syrup, corn starch, corn solids, whatever in it. He isn't DEATHLY allergic, but he does get hives, swell up a bit, get a migraine, etc. It isn't pleasant, and it can take a while to clear up. When he stopped eating corn, he said he felt like a mental fog lifted. His description sounded like how I feel when I get out of allergen heavy area and get a good night's sleep (I'm allergic to dust, mold, and mildew and apparently most if not all fur bearing mammals). It's not life threatening, but it absolutely lowers the quality of life in minor, irritating ways that build up over time.
Posted 10 months ago # -
Grass either settles their stomachs or makes them puke on its own, unless someone's been sneaking in at night and hosing down my yard with pesticides without my noticing. And a wild dog eating garbage and squirrels without competition from any other, better predator is still a domestic animal relying on a human-created environment, eating basically the same variety of stuff humans eat (plus some things they wouldn't). You might get a feral dog pack in a really shitty rural community, but you won't get one way out in the middle of nowhere.
The corn thing is hilarious when you find out just how completely pointless it is. It wouldn't be there if it wasn't dirt-cheap filler, and it wouldn't be cheaper than actually nutritious stuff if corn wasn't subsidized so heavily. Basically you're paying extra to encourage major manufacturers to feed you shit and there's not a thing you can do about it!
Posted 10 months ago # -
You might get a feral dog pack in a really shitty rural community, but you won't get one way out in the middle of nowhere.
The really shitty semi-rural community my parents live in has at least one feral dog pack and also coyotes, but I have relatives that live in the middle of nowhere where people lock their garbage down to keep wild life out, and they still report feral dog packs. The "pack" is usually 2-3 animals at a time, and usually wind up shot by people who live there, or hit by cars.The corn situation in the US really bugs the hell out of me.
Posted 10 months ago # -
birdtongue
Memberferal dogs tend to be worse than coyote simply because they have no wariness of humans, no matter their current diet. we haven't had to shoot any yet, and hopefully we'll never cross paths with them.
it's interesting how the corn thing is just a shitstorm of bad policies at all levels -- if you threw in over-tilling and clearcutting of trees, and deregulated the allowable toxicity levels downstream, it would be the perfect storm of shortsightedness.
Posted 10 months ago # -
maecrab
MemberI didn't mean to start all this drama, guys!
When I said 'grain is bad for dogs,' for one I meant useless; they don't get anything out of it. And by 'grain' I meant corn, oats, and rice, even though lots of vets say that brown rice can be a great filler because of the health reasons Ivan mentioned (helps clean out their digestive systems, which is important because again, in the wild, dogs wouldn't ONLY eat the meat on the animal, but also the hide, bones, and little gristly bits and, as mentioned, the contents of the stomachs which is likely all vegetation, but unless they're farm-raised, not a whole lot of grains) and also to lower the fat content of food that, admit it, is great for wolves but pretty rich for housepets.
All of the raw/natural diet people I looked up said veggies WERE good for dogs, especially raw, when they have most of their vitamins and roughage qualities. My dogs graze constantly on weeds, grass, and bush leaves in my yard, and never throw up because of it, so I think it does give them something they need.
But it's important to understand the things that are going on physiologically with modern dog breeds as a result of selective inbreeding. One interesting thing a raw food writer pointed out on his website was that unless you raise a puppy eating raw meat, and even then, you might have to exclude certain breeds, you're not just going to be able to toss your dog a haunch and let 'em at it once a week, because the neck and back muscles wild candids build up to do that aren't used much by household dogs, and you can't just make those appear overnight. Not to mention the diarhhea and illness for weeks involved with changing a dog's diet like that. The other thing is that dogs raised on your standard Pedigree have been used their whole lives to eating something more than half useless to them, and that is basically soup by the time they're done chewing, much less once their stomach's done with it. Meat? RAW meat? Not so much.
And keep in mind that the physical problems you, Ivan, mentioned with Greyhounds are 1. because those dogs are horribly treated overall and 2. Greyhounds are a fucked up, inbred mess with shit-tons of health problems even raised with a family instead of psychologically damaged beyond repair from puppyhood. I'm sure their diet contributes to their overall situation (as well as the quantity and frequency of the meals), and I hate it, too, when people act like the new "organic" "green" "natural" thing is a universal panacea for their dogs or themselves (or their children, god forbid).
If I switched my dogs to a meat diet, I would 1. probably not use raw food, because of their age, having been accustomed to cheap (and now expensive) kibble and 2. DEFINITELY mix some veggies in with their meals.
Even when I was trying out different kibbles with my dogs, when I was using one very high in protein (70%) my dogs got terrible gas, because they, as life-long housepets, cannot digest that much protein, or, by the same token, use it. Maybe they would have adjusted if I had let them at it for months, but if you've ever been in a house with 3 large, farting dogs I'm sure you can understand my reasons. If I switched them to a meat diet, I think a kind of 'protein training program' would be in order.
Anyway, I think a meat (raw or cooked) diet CAN be cheaper and healthier for dogs, and I know there're some good recipes out there. My grandmother's Yorkie eats only roast chicken and ground beef (usually cooked the same way she cooks them for herself), out of necessity (the dog stopped eating after my grandma's other dog passed away, and a 3 pound dog doesn't have a lot of weight to lose). But if you don't have a good idea of what you're doing, or your dog's diet becomes a pattern of what you decide is "best for it" based on flavor-of-the-month new-age-hippy-bullshit, you can easily fuck them up that way as with any number of other ways.Moving on, the corn filler/corn syrup thing brings us back to a lot of the nutrition topics we'd discussed earlier here, because it can be hard to keep these kinds of things out of your diet when you're poor. It basically forces you to cook your own foods, which is important in a lot of ways, but it's hard to get out of the habit of buying a soda and a bag of doritos to eat at work or whatever. I have to bike 8 miles home from work, so often I find myself grabbing a candy bar or something out of the vending machine for energy.
And I'm a vegetarian, so i won't comment on a lot of the meat/hunting stuff, but if I ate meat I would NOT eat ANYTHING, fish, squirrel, or snake (or whatever) living wild in an urban environment, and I have difficulty visualizing anyone so desperate for a cheap scrap of meat that they'd head into the park with a BB gun or whatever. And I can think of no way hunting (squirrels for example) with projectiles or traps can be safe for you and others in an urban environment. I think for these and other (meat's expensive, yo) reasons Spike was planning on recommending vegetarianism in the book, not 100%, but just generally. Meat is a treat (and I'm a poet and don't know it).Posted 10 months ago # -
Raw meat diets for animals absolutely need to include more than just hunks of meat. They should include eggs, egg shells, bones/marrow, and veggies as well as other stuff.
Our Australian Shepherd/mutt LOVED carrots and apple chunks and cheese. He'd also gorge on bread, but that was a behavioral thing.
Posted 10 months ago # -
maecrab
MemberOne of my dogs won't eat veggies; she just delicately takes them from our hands with her very front teeth, just to be polite, and quietly dumps it in a corner. But my other dog has an INSANE love of baby carrots. They both love peanuts.
I heard that cheese was almost as bad for dogs as chocolate. Anyone else know about this?Posted 10 months ago # -
It actually takes a LOT of chocolate to hurt most dogs. It's not super great for them by any means, but it's not the death sentence a lot of people fear. I mean, if your toy poodle snarfs down a five pound box of chocolate? That's a problem. Your lab eats a few stray M&Ms? Keep an eye on it, but don't panic. ( http://www.talktothevet.com/ARTICLES/DOGS/chocolatetoxic.HTM )
The problem with dogs and cheese/dairy is that adult dogs are usually lactose intolerant. Too much cheese/milk/vanilla ice cream/whipped cream and they get cramps, bloating, raunchy farts, and explosive diarrhea. That is... not fun for anyone. But for most dogs, a few cubes of cheese here or there won't hurt them.
Posted 10 months ago # -
maecrab
MemberOooh, and one last thing: The Humane Society in my area has a thrift store that specializes in VERY discounted pet items like still-in-packages pet treats, toys, food, nail clippers, collars, whatever. You should definitely check with your local branch before heading to Petco.
Posted 10 months ago # -
Speaking of thrift stores, several thrift stores in my area sell diapers and stuff that are brand new in packing. However, one place sells them for MORE than you would get them at the actual store they are from. (bwuh?) Also, craigslist frequently has formula exchange/discounted formula deals going on... either from people who got cases of formula from the back of a truck, or people on WIC who can only get one brand, but whose babies need a different brand.
Posted 10 months ago # -
fishcake
MemberYeah that isn't really true though, any more than saying that because we're "omnivores" we can and have to eat literally everything with no discernment. Dogs need meat, but they can eat pretty much anything people do, and you can look at any rescue greyhound and see how badly a raw-meat-only diet fucks them up, everything from their guts twisting themselves in knots to their teeth rotting out of their heads at age three.
Wow really? Damn that's interesting
You a Bio/Vet major by any chance?Posted 10 months ago # -
Nah, had to deal with those same rescue dogs is all. It's sort of a crash course in what different varieties of animal abuse will do long-term.
They get fed basically a meat slurry for every meal, I guess because it builds up their muscles for racing, and by the the time they're used up pretty much all of them have their teeth worn and rotted away. Between that and the arthritis a lot of 'em got they were basically the dog equivalent of paraplegics.
Posted 10 months ago # -
fishcake
MemberI love how domestication and human effects on animal behaviour are pretty much ignored in undergraduate courses
Posted 10 months ago # -
Are they? I assumed that was pretty much what ag sci and vet courses were about. What do they teach?
Posted 10 months ago # -
fishcake
MemberI should have specified
I love how BIOLOGY undergraduate bla bla bla
Though I dunno, a lot of what I've seen in the third and fourth years touch on that
The concentration seems to be on nature and the wild thoughahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh whatevs
E:Has there ever been a thread here that has stayed on topic past the 5 page mark?
apart from the banana thread of coursePosted 10 months ago # -
pencilears
MemberI have difficulty visualizing anyone so desperate for a cheap scrap of meat that they'd head into the park with a BB gun or whatever. And I can think of no way hunting (squirrels for example) with projectiles or traps can be safe for you and others in an urban environment.
I think everybody knows that urban hunting is impractical, (although not that impractical) it's mostly just fun to think about.
getting back on subject,
I saw today downtown some people with a chicken run in their side yard which reminded me of the FFA (future farmers of america) meetings I went to back in junior highschool when they were running a fat chicken contest.
so, chickens are a lot happier with a bit of grass to run around on but they will pretty quickly peck and scratch it to bare mud. so it's important if you have a bunch of chickens in a chicken run in your yard to move them and their whole coop/run set up around your yard.
the chicken poop left in the old spot makes good fertilizer and your chickens will be happier and produce better eggs on new grass.
it's also important to look into what breed of chicken you're getting, big chickens need more space and food but little chickens make little eggs, some breeds are better for certain climates, that kind of thing.
and what time of year you purchase your hens is important, they don't lay eggs in the winter so buying chicks in the fall and raising them inside during the winter will produce bigger stronger birds when they start producing eggs in the spring.also, you can raise rabbits for meat in a similar set up. I know a few people who do the "meat or pets" rabbit business but you don't have to go commercial.
Posted 10 months ago # -
pencilears
Member- A word on college educations
and cheap studio time.so, I wanted to say that community colleges are pretty much fantastic. in my state two years at a community college (an associates of arts degree) means I start regular college as a junior having paid a quarter of the price in tuition than I would have otherwise.
as an artist the community college is also good because they have a pottery studio.(and cheap art classes in general) ours was open from 5am to 11pm week days and something like 7am to 9pm weekends and dropping in at weird hours meant having the whole place to myself.
I knew a couple of real artists in that class using the resources of the studio, the wheels, the kilns, the glazes, and the teachers to make stuff they intend to sell.
the class was like 300$ for a whole quarter of as much studio time as you want (it was mostly BYO clay but I was given some re-pug in exchange for being pro at mopping) which this guy who was there all day, every day, said was a deal for studio time.Posted 10 months ago # -
The quality of community colleges varies based on where you are, and not all of them are accredited. If you plan the community college route (which can really really work out for some folks), check before hand to see if any of your credits will transfer to other colleges you're interested in. Several people I know have had to retake classes because the credits didn't transfer. Two people I know had to do the same when transferring from one state college to another, so it's not limited to community colleges, but it IS more common there.
In retrospect, I should have tried CC before "real" college.
Posted 10 months ago #
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